Most PHP coders suck!

djmaze · Posted: Sat Aug 04, 2007 7:40 am

This is spinning in my head for years and i need to get it out:

PHP coders suck!

They all think they are good and always ask stupid questions.
But somehow, at work, i always end-up fixing all that crap code loads of others have made.

People please: Programming is for the educated so stop designing commercial software if you know s**t about it.
That way i don't get the crap companies place on my plate when the previous "programmer" couldn't understand it anymore.

kguske · Site Admin Joined: Jun 04, 2004 Posts: 4620

Ouch!

There are lots of issues here...

Are PHP developers worse that developers who use other languages?

The first reaction for many is that the language doesn't matter - poor developers are poor in any language. But PHP supports, if not encourages, poor code because it's too forgiving. You want to change a variable definition on the fly? No problem! Mix OO, structured and unstructured code in the same script? Go ahead! You don't need any discipline to make PHP scripts functional.

But as for fixing crap from other developers, that certainly isn't limited to PHP.

What can you do? Why not develop a guide for good code? Like "Elements of PHP Style"... Then, you could sell it on Packt Publishing!

djmaze · Posted: Sat Aug 04, 2007 8:30 am

good idea kguske but why bother writing such guide if poor coders never read anyway?

Yes poor coders exist in any language, even C++, but as you said PHP invites you to do more damage then poor code.

Gremmie · Posted: Sat Aug 04, 2007 9:28 am

There are a lot of bad C++ programmers too. Oh the things I have seen... Smile

djmaze · Posted: Sat Aug 04, 2007 9:37 am

This was my cheerup in the past Wink

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kguske · Site Admin Joined: Jun 04, 2004 Posts: 4620

If you have a guide, you can recommend it to the people before you get stuck with the mess they create. If they don't use it, you'll be justified in calling them out for it. If they do read it and don't follow it, they should be able to defend their position or be terminated... Basically, it takes away the excuses, and you could make some money in the process.

montego · Posted: Sun Aug 05, 2007 9:16 am

Well, I cannot comment on the professional coder part because I am not one of them (really??? lol). However, I cannot tell you how many times in my business that I just sit and shake my head at what "programmers" come up with in terms of user interface and overall system design. Really pretty pathetic much of the time now. No real business sense, just college degrees (at least those software vendors that I deal with). Software vendors are pulling less expensive labor straight out of college and assuming that a programmer is a "dime a dozen". Shameful....

Gremmie · Posted: Sun Aug 05, 2007 10:01 am

The biggest problem I have seen is getting too many young kids out of college to work on a project without a senior programmer or two to steer them, to teach them, etc. That is when you get the unworkable messy code.

evaders99 · Moderator Joined: Apr 30, 2004 Posts: 2749

It's the way the world works. Its cheaper to hire young kids who will do the work for cheap. After a few years, you lay them off and hire some new kids. And thus is the cycle of CS majors. Wink

Plus with the internet, it is much easier for college kids to try and strike it rich. Look at Facebook and other social network sites. They're pretty much all started with a young crowd.

I'm not saying that lazy coding isn't bad... but for programmers today, society requires quick development and return. You want to get your product out before your competition. This isn't where you can spend tons of reviews on your code.
PHP makes it happen by providing a simple C-style syntax with many, many functions. Its allows very quick, very lazy development with really little pre-production. Even the developers have encouraged this by not focusing on OOP fully (until PHP 5). I think that's why it has taken off for the majority of web sites today.

Can we do better? Certainly.. I believe PHP 6 will enforce better coding. From what I've read, warnings will have to be dealt with and things like magic_quotes_gpc will no longer exist.

Donovan · Client Joined: Oct 07, 2003 Posts: 675 Location: Ohio

Well I just got a new job in the Dayton Ohio area. I start Tuesday at Wright State University supporting the Interdisciplinary Teaching Laboratory at the School of Medicine. They have a testing and grading application they built using PHP and MySQL. I will keep up the development of the project and also create another application to support some Team Learning initative.

I am by no means a professional PHP developer, but I try and follow good coding practices. I have asked advice from Kevin, Montego, Evaders, and Raven countless times and will continue to do so.

It seems some developers starting out may not ask for help, and end up with buggy code. Hopefully they don't put such stuff in production, but it happens.